Patrick Cadigan: 0:00

What is Post Secondary Transition? All right, consider the question, what do you want for your child after they leave school? Now, this is going to include research, using resources and setting goals. And it's a lot of information, there is a lot to consider. Now trying to do all of that at once can feel really consuming. And it's going to be a unique experience. But there are other families who are going through it at the same time that you are. So that's why we're here having conversations that will ask parents to think long term. So welcome. This is the Post Secondary Transition podcast. We have conversations around that process for families of students with disabilities, I am, but one of the hosts. My name is Patrick Cadigan. I am a public school special education teacher and who is my co-host?

Meghan Smallwood: 0:46

I am Meghan Smallwood, and I am a public school transition coordinator.

Patrick Cadigan: 0:49

All right, when we are back, and if you did not get a chance to catch it, both Meghan and I were featured very prominently on the T21Mom, podcast, we talked with host, Mary Cardell, she interviewed us she had some really interesting questions around the transition process or wanting to understand the transition process. And as someone who was ever on not only in the west coast, but also in Canada, it was a very new, it was a very revealing conversation for her. So if you don't get a chance, check it out. There'll be a link in the show notes. It's a really good talk. And let's see where are we? Oh, all right. So we have talked about the different kinds of work programs available. Now. These are going to focus in obviously on our county and for our students. However, there is a broader conversation to be had about what is available for students earning a diploma. So yes, we are going to be talking about specifics in terms of what Meghan and I both have had experience with. But we want to open up broader conversations and ask bigger questions, so that you guys are thinking what questions you would ask for the area that you're in. So what to start off with, what are students earning a diploma to do if they're interested in specific career field or want to explore as much as possible during their time in high school?

Meghan Smallwood: 2:32

We have a pathway in our county called CTE, which is the Career and Technical Education, which is fairly common amongst the Maryland counties. What is offered in each county might be different, but there are some, you know, offerings out there. For our all attended purpose for our conversation. While talking about CTE, we have courses that usually start in middle school, and provide our students with some of those academic and technical skills as well as that knowledge and training in order to be successful in future careers. But like I said, it starts at middle school. And they have usually a basic technology class. And then in high school, one of the requirements for graduation is for our students to each earn at least one computer science, engineering, and technical education, technology, education credit. And that could be a simple like foundations of technology, Exploring Computer Science, or an intro to engineering design, just a very, you know, started a class, but everyone is required to have one. Now if a student has a real interest in pursuing something in that field, or another area that's you know, in our career academy, then that can be the path they take for their graduation requirements. Because for our county, the other graduation requirement is to take two world language classes. And four languages can be hard, right? We know that, especially for some of our friends who might have an IEP and, you know, have some struggles with comprehension and whatnot. So having another option besides the world language is just a nice choice. But regardless, it's just good for the students, and the parents. If you know you are interested in getting more information to talk to the guidance counselor, the transition specialist if you have one at your school, or in our county, we have a new position called the College and Career Readiness advisor who is there to help our students better prepare for life after high school. So any one of those people can help shine some more light on what a career academy is. So what is the Career Academy? So in our county, they offer our students with similar interests the opportunity to prepare for either college or some entry level employment in a career interest area. They want them to be able to meet the demands of the 21st century global economy. So they're giving them all the skills that they can before they leave, you know, the school system, which I have to say, I wish I had this option when I was in school, we did not have career academies growing up in my area. And I think it just would have been really interesting to have, instead of just sitting in my basic everyday classes, but in school in the school building, in their home school students can access career academies, such as accounting, business classes, and marketing. I know we have a wide range of those computer programming, the culinary science field, and engineering. And we have a Teacher Academy to which I know gives our students the opportunity to actually go and do an internship in the classroom with students to really feel like if that's what they want to do, to go to college and, and study. The one class I really want to highlight, though, that I think is just amazing and I wish every student can take, it's called the Career Research and Development or CRD class. It's one of those pathways that really introduces the students to explore different career interests, set some goals for what they might want. But it also introduces them and gives them a little exposure to financial literacy, something I wish every student had before they exited High School, and just how to navigate those challenges of the world of work. So within that class, and it's a two year class, I'll get into a little more detail about that second year, but they really get to work on perfecting their resume a bit more, they participate in a job fair, they really get down and research the employment opportunities for the career interest that they have. And you know, it goes beyond that initial, what am I going to study in college? It really has them look at what is the salary range, you know, what are the requirements and the job responsibilities, what I know businesses, what I find this specific job, and it just makes them really branch out and see what is involved in that career. So like I said, it's a two year class. So the second year that they take the CRD component is they have to concurrently enroll in a site based work experience for our county. So while they take the class during the day, they are also expected to have a job and be working an average of 10 to 20 hours a week. And depending on their credits, so that they are reflecting on said job within their CRD class and really putting those skills that they've learned and worked on, you know, in CRD one to use. They need to work a little bit of time within the school day so that the teacher can go out and evaluate and talk to the employer. But it's really there's some flexibility, you know, if they're working on the weekends, or the evenings, whatever works best for the student. But it's a really nice way to for the students to practice at time management between having a job and going to class, which I think really, if they are going to college helps them prepare for you know, life after high school.

Patrick Cadigan: 8:09

So for this, are the students, are they expected to find the job themselves? Or did they get assistance with that, like, how does it work?

Meghan Smallwood: 8:17

The expectation is that they are finding a job for themselves. I know our CRD teacher prep some if they are in CRD one the year prior that spring and says look, you need to come in at the start of the school year with a job, you want to hit the ground running, you want to have those hours from day one, because they're going to need a lot of hours in order to meet the graduation requirements. So we like them to find a job of the summer, if they start working over the summer great, they've already got that relationship established with an employer. If they come in and they don't have a job then that we're front loading the work to have them apply online during class and make calls and go out and interview so that they are able to find a job now I say a job but it could also be volunteer opportunities. You know, they don't have to be getting paid as long as you're doing some form of work. For our students with IEPs I've had some in the past that maybe they got a job and it didn't work out. And there was kind of a pattern of some help being needed. So I would step in in you know, go with the the student on an interview or help them complete the applications or help find them a volunteer opportunity. So it's very individualized, but they have to make the attempt themselves to find some kind of work first.

Patrick Cadigan: 9:31

Okay, so what I'm hearing is like career academies within the building, is there something else that is like outside of the school building?

Meghan Smallwood: 9:40

Yeah, and this is really neat, because when I went to a state meeting a couple weeks ago, it was it was interesting to hear, you know, other counties in Maryland and how they have career academies and their setup because every county handles it differently and what they offer is different so it was cool to hear the experiences within our county. We do have career academies outside of the school building, we hold it at one central location that, you know, is within right near a Board of Ed. And that's where they offer, you know, specific career classes. They're usually two year programs for junior year for the upperclassmen, junior and seniors. And we have such a variety we have aerospace engineering, agricultural science, I think one of the most popular ones is the animation and interactive media. There's architecture, construction, cybersecurity, health professions HVAC. There's, there's a good bit, and I know that there are plans in place to bring even more because it's just a booming industry of these careers. So the students, of course, have to complete some prerequisite coursework before they can get there for as their upperclassmen years. And there is a waitlist I know a lot of these academies fill up. So that's why, you know, I was stressed to my families during ninth and 10th grade and the students, if they're really interested in these career fields, they want to make sure they have their prerequisites done, and they want to get, you know, the information in their name out there so that they are chosen to participate in these academies. bus transportation is provided to and from the classes since it isn't a location outside of their their normal school building, within the school hours. So, you know, they're back in time to complete their other courses at the school building.

Patrick Cadigan: 11:30

And then how did the students get involved with this? Like, where does it start?

Meghan Smallwood: 11:35

So it's definitely the student advocating for their interests, when they meet with their guidance counselor at registration time, you know, I think it's important for the student every year, to let the guidance counselor know, you know, hey, I really am interested in construction, I'd like to really explore what options I have while I'm in high school to get some more experience in that field. And you know, just keeping in touch with the guidance counselor making sure they're on track with the prerequisites and making sure that they are on that list junior year, to go over to the the Career Academy. It's a two year program. So usually that first year, you know, they're doing a lot of the coursework. And many of these programs the second year has, like an internship component, or there's some, you know, certifications or industry credentials that they can actually receive by passing some assessments or examinations within them. And so they're leaving high school with some of these credentials that really makes them stand out for wherever they go. I know, for example, with the the health career fields, the health professions, they will get CPR and First Aid certified. I mean, that's great. You know, we have some students who are interested in becoming like EMTs, and they're already well on their way towards that path. So it's just a really good opportunity for the students.

Patrick Cadigan: 12:52

Okay, so it sounds like we're doing a pretty good job of making programs like this available, as because as I'm thinking about additional careers, or gaining experience, are there any are there any apprenticeships?

Meghan Smallwood: 13:09

The Apprenticeship Maryland, which I know is not just in our county, so it's just a great pathway for our seniors in our county, who are interested in employment and further education on a specific career pathway. And they're usually within the stem industries. So I know, it's really grown over the past few years in our county, for our seniors, they will be working like a minimum of 450 hours for the school year, within this industry, while also taking the classroom instruction that goes with it. And some of our students, you know, depending on what credits they might have left to complete to graduate, they might be doing night school, or, you know, classes back in the building. So it's an individualized process. And also, if a student is interested in participating in the apprenticeship, that's definitely something they want to apply early on and talk to their guidance counselor about. But what happens is that they are being trained by these, you know, specific industries, you know, we have students who have been in the electrical apprenticeship, and they are actually reporting for work and being trained by real electricians, you know, who ultimately would love to hire them for their business because it's benefit to them, they're training people right out of school, and these students are leaving school with that experience, you know, and a couple years later, be making a huge salary. So it's just a great opportunity if the the interest is there and you want to learn the skills for this trade. And you know, this is the pathway you want. Like I mentioned, electric, electrical, we also have the construction. I know there's environmental and agricultural apprenticeships, human resources, information technology, and just more to come. But one of the requirements I know for us for Are county is that they do have to have their own transportation in order to get to some of these work sites. Because for the electrical, for example, they might have to actually be at the business at 6:30 in the morning, you know, there's no bus coming to get them, they're not going to the school building and then going out there reporting right to an employer, and starting their day there. So that is one thing I stress to a lot of students who might be interested, you know, you might want to, you have to work on your driver's license, you know, there's a little more motivation, like, let's see if we can get that license done before your senior year, so that you're able to participate in this. Because there's just so many benefits to it. And last year, I was able to go to one of the open houses that they provided for staff just to come and see the students and hear from them firsthand. And the students are just so appreciative of the support from the the employers and the employers are just so excited to have this youth coming out to continue on in their their chosen field. It's just a great relationship. So I would definitely encourage anyone who's specifically, you know, interested in a specific career and know, that's really what they want to do to explore the apprenticeships and just get more information about it.

Patrick Cadigan: 16:10

And then, as I'm listening to this, and as you're talking about it, like, one of the questions that I have is, is there like a profile, a student profile for this like, which is who is what what type of student would benefit from this?

Meghan Smallwood: 16:26

It's hard to profile. I mean, we've had students with disabilities, students with IEP students, a file for students without IPs are five, of course, it's really, you know, for that student who college is not the path that they think they want to take, they know that they want to do something in a specific skill, and they want more training on a skill. I think it's possible, you know, they could go and complete college as well. But they, they really know that they're dedicated to this trade, we, you know, through the apprenticeship, especially, they don't want a student who's going to come in, because they might want to try it. And then man, within a couple of weeks, they're done. They want someone who's going to be dedicated and will work the hours and you know, put the work in to actually take it seriously and want to learn something and like I said, a lot of these places want to hire them. So it's a it's a mutual benefiting relationship.

Patrick Cadigan: 17:29

But it definitely sounds like something like again, like what you were saying is, is that if college is not necessarily something that a student would be interested in long term, that this is definitely a path moving forward, that would give them work experience. And, you know, thus a kind of a leg up when they're out looking...

Meghan Smallwood: 17:50

Yeah, and you know, their students who I know started in the program finish after they graduated. And like I said, their business is booming. They constantly have work, and they are making a huge salary, while some of their friends who went to college and still aren't sure what they want to do have a lot of debt to pay. So there's definitely some huge benefits to it.

Patrick Cadigan: 18:13

Wait a minute. You mean, when you go to college, you walk away with debt? Get out!

Meghan Smallwood: 18:17

Oh, my gosh, I know, right? We should do a whole podcast on that. What to prepare for?

Patrick Cadigan: 18:24

No, no, no, I, I'm still paying off mine. So that is not necessarily a conversation that I want to think about actively. All right, but that sounds good. All right. Well, before we let you guys go, we wanted to throw out a another Well, That's Helpful resource. And this time, it's on me. And this this the reason that I'm going to throw out this resource. I was thinking about this as we were having our conversation with Mary, Mary Cardle from T21Mom podcast, that, you know, there were agencies, there were things that she sort of knew about, but then wasn't 100% sure about and that wanted me that led me to want to highlight one of our pages, where when you go to postsecondarytransition.com. We have a what is a DDA page. Now, we've already had conversations on the podcast about this. We have had we've like talked, I feel like DDA comes up all the time. So for our purposes for this website, I mean, it gives a basic overview of what Developmental Disabilities Administration would be. We have some links to other resources, like, for example, from Pathfinders for autism, but we even created a page that talked about that goes like through a pretty detailed explanation of the eligibility review. It talks about priority levels supports Yeah, things like, you know, ideas about you know what's going to happen next. And even links to contact information application page, just a whole host of links a whole host of supports, go check it out www.postsecondarytransition.com/whatisDDA. And that is our Well, That's Helpful resource.

Meghan Smallwood: 20:24

Good resource.

Patrick Cadigan: 20:25

Good resource. All right. And speaking of resources, you're going to follow the information from this conversation in our show notes. We're going to have some links in there. Please, like, follow and share out this podcast. We are looking to build our audience and we need your help to do it. Visit our YouTube channel, we've posted videos of all our conversations, and it also includes doing some of the legwork for you. We've curated videos of topics that revolve around transition. We have playlists, like cover, guardianship alternatives, ABLE accounts, and there's going to be more to come. So be sure to subscribe there as well. And then last but not least, I've already asked once, I'll ask one more time, check out the website chock full of information around transition, you'll find our contact information there. We do have a blog. So go to www.postsecondarytransition.com. Check it out. It is a really good place to visit.

Meghan Smallwood: 21:25

I agree. All right, Ms. Meghan. So let's see. We're going to knock this one out. And what do we have coming up? I believe we're gonna have some more interviews, right? Yeah. We've got some interviews coming up, I believe, so...

Patrick Cadigan: 21:37

All right, good. Well, yeah, I'm looking forward to that one. All right. Then we'll we'll let's go ahead and close out this conversation. And thank you guys for joining us, and we'll be talking to you soon.

Meghan Smallwood: 21:50

Bye, guys.